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Author Topic: Oswald nitrate test.........Question  (Read 2186 times)
JFKRFK4Ever
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« on: January 11, 2008, 02:34:20 PM »

In Oliver Stone's movie JFK it said that Oswald had went through a nitrate test and it indicated that he hadn't fired a rifle on Nov. 22 1963. I was wondering where I could find info about this. Thanks in advance.
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MinM
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« Reply #1 on: January 12, 2008, 10:24:43 AM »

Pat Speer for one has some good stuff on this ( btw Len, Pat Speer would make an excellent guest ):

http://www.patspeer.com/chapter4c%3Acastsofcontention

Interesting discussion between Len and Jim D last night:
http://www.blackopradio.com/black374a.ram

If LHO was actually in Mexico City --

Why didn't the CIA get a picture of Oswald?

Not Mike Ditka!!!
« Last Edit: December 22, 2009, 05:33:25 AM by MinM » Logged

JFKRFK4Ever
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« Reply #2 on: January 12, 2008, 05:43:12 PM »

Thank you so much MinM!!!!
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PurpleHaze
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« Reply #3 on: December 21, 2009, 09:26:33 AM »

I never understood what Syrian nuke sites had to do with Oswald's paraffin tests, but the tests seem to be yet another example of an often repeated "fact" that ain't necessarily so. The tests really don't prove anything, and apparently wouldn't stand up in a court case, because they can yield both false positives and negatives. They don't prove that Oswald didn't fire a gun, or that he did.
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Supreme Court finds limited value in paraffin tests as evidence

As part of the experiment, he said, 17 men were made to fire five shots of a .38 cal. revolver using one hand only. After each string, both hands were subjected to paraffin testing.

Eight of the test subjects showed negative or essentially negative results on both hands. This means that, at least for the experiment, paraffin tests did not work half the time.

Three men showed positive results on the idle hand, but were negative on the firing hand. Four men tested positive on both hands, after having fired only with their right hand. Even if they do work, paraffin tests can sometimes give the wrong results. http://www.abovetopsecret.com/forum/thread496802/pg1

It is meaningless to ascribe value to said test because the test itself was inaccurate. You cannot establish validity when reliability is so low period. Oswald's negative test is of no value. Nothing can be said of ithttp://educationforum.ipbhost.com/lofiversion/index.php/t5975.html
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bern494
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« Reply #4 on: December 22, 2009, 05:25:10 AM »

I would suggest a perfect test would be to get somebody to take a rifle that was wrapped up in a blanket, place it (dismantled) into a bag, then take it out of the bag re-assemble it (with a dime coin) and load the rifle, then fire 3 shots with it, and then carry it 30 yd or so and throw it among some boxes.
Get that same man to wait 20 Min's or so, yes he could even wash his hands. Pick up a revolver, try to fire it! THEN do a paraffin test on his hands and face, then match it to Lee Harvey Oswald's tests and see what the results might be. I suggest a distinct difference.

Bern
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SSTEVE60
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« Reply #5 on: December 22, 2009, 04:05:00 PM »

I would suggest a perfect test would be to get somebody to take a rifle that was wrapped up in a blanket, place it (dismantled) into a bag, then take it out of the bag re-assemble it (with a dime coin) and load the rifle, then fire 3 shots with it, and then carry it 30 yd or so and throw it among some boxes.
Get that same man to wait 20 Min's or so, yes he could even wash his hands. Pick up a revolver, try to fire it! THEN do a paraffin test on his hands and face, then match it to Lee Harvey Oswald's tests and see what the results might be. I suggest a distinct difference.

Bern

This is all fine and good if any Mannlicher-Carcano could've done the job but, of course it couldn't. The Carcano model in question is not even a rifle. It is a carbine which is a low-powered, close quarters weapon. On top of that, it was known as "The Humanitarian Weapon" because it misfired so often. It literally has been called a better club than a gun.
The shooting was the work of a few high-powered, accurate rifles manned by trained and accurate assassins. To lay this at the feet of a poor shot like Oswald was, and then have him use a ridiculous weapon looks to me that, although he may have taken the blame initially, he was never to have kept the blame. The story they cooked up is so flimsy that I believe that possibly Oswald was going to walk and that plan was hijacked in the end. This, is lent some credence in that there is now believed to have been more than one Oswald and Richard Case Nagell was convinced Oswald(the one he knew) was an agent working for the Soviets. It's not a stretch to think this all could've gone wrong if one or more of the perpetrators felt threatened by the cover story.
Of course the part I've laid out stating Oswald may have walked is pure speculation on my part, but you've gotta wonder why they set him up with such a flimsy story.
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bern494
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« Reply #6 on: December 22, 2009, 05:42:20 PM »

That's all fine and good!!! I totally agree with your views on the rifle and on Oswald himself but the question was as to whether the nitrate test were of any use in 1963. I was endorsing the fact that had the test I suggested had been carried out then the results from Lee Harvey Oswald test would have differed greatly thus substantiating the fact that Lee could of not done what they said he had.

Bern
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chuck1972
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« Reply #7 on: December 24, 2009, 08:00:38 AM »

mark lane has lectured on this point in nearly every recorded debate i have been able to find and used to mention it in the lectures he gave in new york. the test showed nitrates on the palm and the pattern for what was missing is the important thing. the test shows no sign of what one would expect from someone handling a riffle and firing 3 live rounds. even though the dallas police publicly said the test was positive. ch. curry and da wade said it several times in tv and radio appearances that weekend. it has always puzzled me why this does not exclude oswald in the minds of single shooter supporters, but then again if you traveled back in time and simply used a digital camcorder to film the real shooter from 3 nice angles and then got  a confession from him they'd say it was just hollywood magic. in the search for facts i am often driven crazy by this and a close second to this refusal to see reality that i find so maddening is the crowd that would accept any wild theory. i once heard some one say it could be that an alien spaceship beemed the assasins in for the shots and beamed them right back out afterwards... but the truth is this only happened one way. an honest explanation from our governmemt would have been nice but here we are more than 45 years later and still no clear truth in the millions of pages released by the authorities
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Brutality either builds or pulverises charector
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