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Curtis LeMay in @XCompany on @CBC
  • MinMMinM
    Posts: 444

    LeMay on 11/22/63

    This is in relation to a film called Strategic Air Command (1955)


    The government was upset at the portrayal of a secondary character (
    "Gen. Ennis C. Hawkes" played by Frank Lovejoy) who too closely
    resembled the current Air Force commander Curtis LeMay.
    The original drafts of the script hit too close to home. It showed
    him as he was. Super-reactionary and arguably insane. The Studios
    caved and replaced the original screenwriter immediately, but Jimmy
    Stewart and Anthony Mann tried to get their names taken off the picture.
    They failed.

    LeMay was later lampooned in Dr. Strangelove by George C. Scott.

  • MinMMinM
    Posts: 444
    more LeMay in Film:

    Seven Days in film poster from Seven Days in MayMay (1964)

    "A voice next to me said, "do you intend to make a movie out of Seven Days in May?"

    I turned.  President Kennedy!  "Yes, Mr. President."

    "Good."  He spent the next twenty minutes, while our dinner got
    cold, telling me that he thought it would make an excellent movie."  (Ragman's Son, 349)

    History caught up with Kirk Douglas's production of Seven Days in May.  Based
    on a 1962 best-selling novel by Charles V. Bailey and Fletcher Knebel,
    it revealed a plot to overthrow US President Jordan Lyman (Frederic
    March) by members of his own administration, led by conspirators Gen.
    James Mattoon Scott
    (Burt Lancaster) and narrowly foiled by Col. Martin
    "Jiggs" Casey, played by Douglas.  Set in the then-distant future of
    1974, it seemed to reflect the real-life clash between General Curtis Le
    and President John F. Kennedy over the Cuban missile crisis.
      A Universal executive declined to consider it
    because of the negative image it might project abroad.  "If…the
    Executive branch of the Government were to encourage the making of this
    film, I'd certainly be happy to reconsider it with you at that time," he

    Apparently Douglas got the go-ahead he needed directly from the President himself.  Rod Serling adapted the novel to the screen and John Frankenheimer not only directed but took a co-production interest.  A letter to Douglas from Leon Kaplan,
    his business/legal advisor, demonstrates the complex partnership and
    financing arrangements that underlay independent production in the early
    1960s. Promotion began long before production even started. In an early example of product placement, special arrangements were made with Bulova for the provision of its state of the art Accutron wristwatches for the picture.

    Douglas sent the screenplay out for comment to various interested and influential figures.  Authors Bailey and Knebel suggested a long list of improvements and Douglas's former director Stanley Kubrick also made suggestions.  The care that Douglas himself took in shaping the film's message can be seen in a long memo to Bryna head producer Edward Lewis reacting to one of the first cuts of the film. 

    However, by the time the film was released in February
    1964, the assassination of President Kennedy in Dallas the preceding
    November made it seem strangely prescient.  Douglas watched the reviews
    carefully, with particular attention to reactions in Europe,
    where it proved a considerable success.  In the end, Douglas and his
    company successfully negotiated the pitfalls inherent in such
    controversial and timely subject matter.  The film received a Blue Ribbon Award from the National Screen Council
    and was nominated for 2 Academy Awards.  Edmond O'Brian won a Golden
    Globe for his supporting role as Senator Raymond Clark.  Serling
    received a nomination from the Writers Guild of America for his

    -- Michele Hilmes, University of Wisconsin-Madison

  • MinMMinM
    Posts: 444

    They’re much less interested in reality and accuracy than they are in
    positive images. They often try to change historical facts that are
    negative. Like with the movie “Thirteen Days,” which was very accurate
    but very negative toward the military during the Cuban missile crisis,
    showing that they would have taken us down the path toward World War
    III. During the negotiations with the producers, Peter Almond and Kevin
    Costner, the military tried to get them to tone down the bellicose
    nature of Gen. Maxwell Taylor and Gen. Curtis LeMay
    -- who the record is
    very clear on, because before Nixon was taping in the White House,
    Kennedy was taping in the White House, and all the conversations from
    October 1962 are on tape. When Kennedy rejected LeMay’s insistence that
    we attack Cuba -- when Kennedy said let’s put up a naval blockade, we
    don’t want to get into war -- you can hear Curtis LeMay say, “This is
    the worst sellout since Munich.”
    He actually said that, when he didn’t
    think anybody was listening. Well, the military wanted to change it
    anyway, saying he was too bellicose and they had to tone it down. To
    their credit, Kevin Costner and Peter Almond stood up to the military,
    refused to buckle under, and made their film without military

  • Can anyone tell me about Curtis LeMay. I mean what are his credentials for being a general. Did he rise through the ranks or was he a CEO of a corporation or whatever. Seems to me he was ready to play fast and loose with other peoples lives.
  • MinMMinM
    Posts: 444
    frethead said:

    Can anyone tell me about Curtis LeMay. I mean what are his credentials for being a general. Did he rise through the ranks or was he a CEO of a corporation or whatever. Seems to me he was ready to play fast and loose with other peoples lives.

    LeMay rose through the ranks. He was also very much a product of the Cold War and the Military Industrial Complex. Or probably more accurately LeMay was one of the fathers and faces of the MIC.

    William Kelly has been putting 2 and 2 together with regards to the recent revelations about Air Force One's radio communications enroute to DC with the body of JFK. Combined with the already documented contentious relationship between LeMay and JFK:


    JFK and General LeMay

    By William Kelly

    The recent discovery of a previously unknown audio tape recording of Air
    Force One radio communications from November 22, 1963 has increased
    public interest in the assassination of President Kennedy and its
    historical implications, some of which still haunt us today as we
    approach its 50th anniversary. 1)

    The tape is but a micro-spectrum of those times, those days, that moment
    when the nation collectively learned that President John F. Kennedy was
    murdered on a Dallas street in a political assassination that shook the
    foundations of government. It was a moment that was quickly followed by
    everyone collectively wondering who was behind the assassination and
    who was now running the country?

    Some people are still wondering, as the tape clearly shows.

    The subject of intense interest as soon as the tape’s existence was
    discovered, a number of historians have used it extensively in the
    course of their narratives, including T.H. White in The Making of the
    President 1964, 2) William Manchester in The Death of the President 3)
    and Max Holland in The JFK Assassination Tapes 4).

    In a footnote to his book, which was commissioned by President Kennedy's
    widow and authorized by the Kennedy family, Manchester notes that, at
    the time of the assassination, “That Friday, Lyndon Johnson did not know
    that John Kennedy had ordered the taping of all Angel (Air Force One
    radio) conversations while the plane was in flight. On April 21, 1964,
    this writer learned that the Love-to-Andrews tape still existed. Since
    security was not involved, it was first thought that a complete
    transcript of it would serve as a useful appendix to this book.
    Presidential consent was withheld however. On May 5, 1965, the author
    was permitted to read an edited transcript at the White House. Doubtless
    the tape will be available to future historians.” 5) ...

    President Kennedy visits SAC Command Post.

    Deep Background: The Rift Between President Kennedy and General LeMay

    - by Douglas Horne, Chief Analyst for Military Records (ARRB)

    General LeMay and President Kennedy shared a barely concealed, mutual
    contempt for each other which was widely known in Washington, and John
    F. Kennedy had more than once walked out of a meeting with LeMay in a
    fit of pique. President Kennedy was so upset when first briefed in
    September 1961 by General Lyman Lemnitzer (Chairman of the Joint Chiefs
    of Staff) about America’s inflexible plan for total, world-wide nuclear
    war, SIOP -62 – the ‘Single Integrated Operational Plan’ for Fiscal Year
    1962 – that he spent most of the meeting tapping on his teeth with his
    thumbnail, a sign of irritation in him, and said in disgust to Secretary
    of State Dean Rusk at the conclusion of the meeting, “And we call
    ourselves the human race.” (Although the target list in the fist SIOP
    had been developed in 1960 – and was officially the brainchild of
    LeMay’s protégé and replacement as head of SAC, General Power – it was
    at heart really LeMay’s plan, even though briefted by Lemnitzer, for it
    reflected LeMay’s personal philosophy of massive and continuing
    retaliation for several days, in the event of nuclear war). ...


  • MinMMinM
    Posts: 444

    Curtis Emerson LeMay was born in Columbus, Ohio, on 15th November 1906. He studied civil engineering at Ohio State University. LeMay joined the United States Air Corps in 1928. Two years later he was commissioned as a second lieutenant.

    In January 1937 he joined the Air Force GHQ at Langley Field. He was a co-pilot of a B-24 Liberator that in August 1941 made a record-breaking flight of almost 25,000 miles. On the plane was W. Averell Harriman, who was on a survey of routes the Ferrying Command would use to deliver Lend Lease to the Soviet Union.

    When the United States entered the Second World War after the bombing of Pearl Harbor, LeMay
    was a lieutenant colonel and commander of the 305th Bomb Group. Five
    months later he was given the responsibility of taking the B-17 Flying Fortress unit to England. While based in England he pioneered daylight bombing, which the RAF had abandoned as it resulted in the deaths of too many men.

    LeMay developed special defensive tactics
    that included tight formations for mutual support. He was also an
    advocate pattern bombing from lower altitudes. These tactics were fairly
    successful and the 305 Bomb Group lost only 13 planes in 25 missions.

    The introduction of P-47 Thunderbolt fighters made B-17 Flying Fortress missions much more effective. On 17th August 1943 LeMay led 126 B-17 aircraft to bomb Germany before being refueled in North Africa. On their return flight they attacked the Focke-Wulf plant in Bordeaux...

  • MinMMinM
    Posts: 444

    Curtis LeMay was promoted to brigadier
    general on 28th September 1943. The following year he took over the 20th
    Bomb Group. Starting in August 1944, Lemay organized the bombing of
    targets in China, Manchuria and Japan.

    Curtis LeMay was involved in the discussions concerning the use of the B-29 Stratafortress bomber to drop the atom bomb on Japan. He helped select the targets of Hiroshima (6th August) and Nagasaki (9th August). On 10th August the Japanese surrendered. The Second World War was over.

    After the war Major General LeMay commanded the USAF in Europe. In 1948 he directed the highly complex Berlin Airlift. In 1951 LeMay became the youngest full general in American history since Ulysses S. Grant.

    In 1949, LeMay was appointed as head of
    Strategic Air Command (SAC) and is credited with overseeing its
    transformation into a modern air force. LeMay was appointed Vice Chief
    of Staff of the United States Air Force in July 1957, serving until 1961
    when he was made the Chief of Staff of the United States Air Force. In
    this post he clashed repeatedly with President John F. Kennedy and his Secretary of Defence, Robert McNamara...

  • MinMMinM
    Posts: 444

    Show #335

    Original airdate: Aug 16, 2007

    Guest: Paul Kuntzler

    Topic: JFK Activist

    Audio Part One

    A short history of Paul Kuntzler leading to his interest in the JFK Assassination
    Took out a full two page ad in the July 31 2007 New York Times with his views on the JFK assassination
    He makes the point JFK stood for change and progress and that led to his death
    He assembled several noted researchers at The Willard Hotel in New York City to discuss the assassination

    The CIA has upwards of 500 reporters and media personell to cloud various issues - Allen Dulles' "Mighty Wurlitzer"
    Paul tells us that Gerald Pozner's 'Case Closed' was ghost written by the CIA and they merely named him author.
    An American representative for Stern Magazine (Germany) intensively interviewed Paul in New York and also in Dallas
    He discusses the limousine windsheild bullet hole that proves there was a front shot and therefore a conspiracy
    Paul names General Curtis LeMay as one of the assassination planners and talks about how he came to discover this
    Paul is a dedicated researcher with a disgust of the continuing coverup of the JFK assassination
    Although he believes in the New York Times and the Washington Post, on this issue they are a 'profound moral disgrace'...
  • MinMMinM
    Posts: 444

    Seven Days In May, Iran, Lee Harvey Oswald, and the Preakness

    Thursday, May 10, 2012


    Seven Days in May was published in 1962. It was made into a motion picture and released in February 1964, with a screenplay by Rod Serling, directed by John Frankenheimer, and starring Burt Lancaster, Kirk Douglas, Fredric March, and Ava Gardner.

    The story is said to have been influenced by the right-wing anti-Communist political activities of General Edwin A. Walker,
    after he was forced to resign from the military. Burt Lancaster's role
    of Air Force General James Mattoon Scott was based, in part, on Walker.
    General Walker was an alleged attempted assassination target of Lee
    Harvey Oswald on April 10, 1963. From the period of the JFK
    assassination forward, General Walker wrote and spoke publicly about his
    belief that Oswald, who Walker thought killed JFK, also shot at him in
    the "April Crime."
    additional inspiration was provided by the 1961 interview conducted by
    Knebel, a political journalist and columnist, with the newly-appointed
    Air Force Chief of Staff, Curtis LeMay,
    an advocate of the first-strike nuclear option. LeMay went on to be the
    vice presidential running mate of American Independent Party
    presidential candidate George Wallace in 1968...

  • LordBaltoLordBalto
    Posts: 219
    "Can anyone tell me about Curtis LeMay. I mean what are his credentials
    for being a general. Did he rise through the ranks or was he a CEO of a
    corporation or whatever. Seems to me he was ready to play fast and loose
    with other peoples lives."

    It has also surfaced recently that LeMay may have been at the actual Kennedy autopsy. In which case it would have been impossible for anyone to do an honest procedure even if they wanted to.
  • MinMMinM
    Posts: 444

    Was LeMay at Camp X on 11/22/63?


    Where was General Curtis LeMay at the time president Kennedy
    was assassinated?


    Was he on vacation hunting and fishing in upstate Michigan,
    as his official biographies attest, or was he at Camp
    X or at a secret command &
    control bunker overseeing the Dealey Plaza

    An official biography of Air Force General Curtis LeMay
    reports that at the time President Kennedy was assassinated he was on vacation,
    hunting and fishing with family members in upstate Michigan.

    "Iron Eagle: The
    Turbulent Life of General Curtis LeMay
    ," by Thomas M. Coffey (p.430) reports
    that LeMay's wife was from Michigan
    and he had apparently told his biographer he was in Michigan
    on vacation and "hurried back to Washington
    in time for the funeral."

    But an Andrews Air Force base log book, that was salvaged
    from the trash and almost destroyed, indicates that LeMay
    ordered a special Air Force jet to pick him up in Canada
    shortly after news of the assassination was widely broadcast, which indicated
    to some that he wasn’t hunting and fishing in Michigan.

    Exploring the possibility that Gen. LeMay attended JFK’s
    autopsy at Bethesda, as Navy
    medical corpsman Paul O’Conner attests, Doug Horne, the Chief Analyst for
    Military Records for the Assassination Records Review Board, made note of LeMay’s
    presence in Canada
    rather than Michigan, as his
    official biography reports.

    And Larry Hancock, author of “Someone Would Have Talked” and
    “Nexus,” also thought it significant and notes: "I was struck by the fact
    that it (LeMay’s bio) made a big deal of his being so
    remote that he was out of contact and was not even able to make it back to Washington
    until the funeral. I don't see that as a minor thing, the book definitely
    creates the impression that he was not back in Washington
    that weekend. This really is an important point, if Doug is right and can be
    verified it looks pretty certain that LeMay was handing
    out disinformation and there would need to be a good reason for that. After
    all, it would not be unusual for him to rush back to DC or to some other AF
    base where he could achieve command and control capability. What seems to me
    not at all understandable is why he would go to Bethesda,
    and then lie about it."

    From the salvaged Andrews Air Force Base Log Book for
    11/22/63, it is officially noted that a special order to pick up LeMay in
    Toronto was requested at 1:20 PM CST (2:20 PM EST, 1420 GMT)
    and a special SAM – Special Air Mission C-140
    jet took off Andrews at 1446 (1:46 PM CST 2:46 PM EST) to pick him up in Toronto,
    but after the plane took off (1:50 PM CST 2:50 PM EST) it was redirected to
    Wiarton, a Canadian Air Force base north of Toronto.

    The official internet web site for Wiarton includes a photo
    of the Air Force base, but also makes tantalizing references to Camp
    X, the secret training camp for
    spies used by the British and Americans during World War II, and used as a
    hideaway for a prominent Soviet defector during the Cold War.

    “Camp X was the unofficial name of a Second World
    War paramilitary and commando training installation, on the
    northwestern shore of Lake Ontario between Whitby and Oshawa in Ontario, Canada.
    The area is known today as Intrepid
    Park, after the code name for Sir
    William Stephenson
     of the British Security Coordination.” ...

  • MinMMinM
    Posts: 444


    “Camp X
    was established December 6, 1941
    by the chief of British Security Coordination (BSC),
    Sir William Stephenson, a Canadian from Winnipeg, Manitoba,
    and a close confidante of Winston Churchill and Franklin Delano
    Roosevelt. The camp was originally designed to link Britain
    and the United States
    at a time when the US
    was forbidden by the Neutrality Act to be directly involved in World War
    II. Before the attack on Pearl Harbor and America's
    entry into the war, Camp X
    opened for the purpose of training Allied agents from the Special Operations
    Executive, Federal Bureau of Investigation, and American Office of
    Strategic Services (OSS) intended to be dropped behind enemy lines as
    saboteurs and spies. However, even before the United
    States entered the war on December 7, 1941, agents from America's
    intelligence services expressed an interest in sending personnel for training
    at the soon to be opened Camp X. Agents head of the OSS,
    who credited Sir William Stephenson with teaching Americans about
    foreign intelligence gathering. The CIA even
    named their recruit training facility "The Farm", a nod to the
    original farm that existed at the Camp X site.”

    “One of the unique features of Camp
    X was Hydra, a highly sophisticated
    telecommunications centre… Hydra also had direct access via land lines to Ottawa, New
    York and Washington,
    D.C. for telegraph and telephone communications…
    In the fall of 1945 Camp X
    was used by the RCMP as a secure location for interviewing Soviet embassy cypher-clerk Igor
    Gouzenko who defected to Canada
    on September 5 and revealed an extensive Soviet espionage operation in the
    country. Post-war, the camp was renamed the Oshawa Wireless Station and
    was turned over to the Royal Canadian Corps of Signals as a wireless
    intercept station, in essence a spy listening station. The Oshawa Wireless
    Station ceased operations in 1969.”

    While the Camp X
    site was still in use as a top-secret and secure military communications base
    in 1963, it is located South East of Toronto, while Wiarton is located northwest
    of Toronto, so they are not near
    each other.

    And although both Toronto and Wiarton are in Canada, they
    are actually south east of the rural lake area of North Michigan where LeMay was
    said to have been at the time of the assassination, and it is possible that
    LeMay flew by private airplane across Lake Huron that separates Michigan and
    Canada, to Wiarton, which is closer to Michigan than Toronto.

    According to the Andrews Log, within an hour of the
    assassination LeMay requested a P/U Pick Up at Toronto, and twenty minutes
    later a C-140 – an Air Force version of a small, executive jet, was sent to
    pick him up, but while it was still in the air, it was diverted to Wiarton, a
    small military base north west of Toronto