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Should Oliver Stone make RFK?
  • I was wanting to share my thoughts on this. I have been thinking for quite awhile now that I would love to see Oliver Stone make a movie about Robert Kennedy's murder just like he did with JFK. I think that since this case isn't as widely known as JFK is it would help to bring to light a lot of information that a lot of people don't already know. I don't know about everyone here but I was very disappointed in Emilio Estevedz's Bobby. I loved the footage of him in it but it wasn't what I thought it should have been. Anyway please discuss your views, thought, and opinions. :) :) :) :)
  • PurpleHazePurpleHaze
    Posts: 717
    author said:


    I was wanting to share my thoughts on this. I have been thinking for quite awhile now that I would love to see Oliver Stone make a movie about Robert Kennedy's murder just like he did with JFK. I think that since this case isn't as widely known as JFK is it would help to bring to light a lot of information that a lot of people don't already know. I don't know about everyone here but I was very disappointed in Emilio Estevedz's Bobby. I loved the footage of him in it but it wasn't what I thought it should have been. Anyway please discuss your views, thought, and opinions. :) :) :) :)



    Wow. Sirhan (with the state's permission, of course) and Thane Eugene Cesar are still alive and could play themselves!  :o Seriously, yes, I'd love to see Stone do an RFK film, although he seems to have wandered off in a different (and wierd?) direction with his last couple of flicks. I enjoyed Alexander, but was surprised to see Stone glorifying war, bloodshed, and conquest. I don't know why he even bothered to make World Trade Center. I tend to agree with you about Bobby. I thought seeing the events from the perspective of the hotel staff was interesting and pretty well done, but the rest was basically fluff, and the "acid trip" scenes, wherein he tried to summarize the insanity of the 60's, were pure corn. Gawd, listen to me, trying to impersonate Siskel and Egghead! :D 

    In the spring of '68 I was 17, and increasingly worried about getting drafted and sent off to LBJ's war, and I adored Gene (the "dragon slayer") McCarthy. I was actually pissed when Bobby Kennedy opportunistically jumped into the fray, after McCarthy had shown that Johnson was vulnerable. That being said, however, I still would've been thrilled to see Kennedy go on to defeat Tricky Dick, and who knows, maybe RFK really could've shaken the heavens by exposing the bastards who killed his brother. (and got us out of Vietnam four years sooner, resolved the bullshit "cold war," and.. we'll never know...)  :(

    I'm very happy to see you back on the board, by the way, JFKRFK4Ever.  ;D
  • I have never seen Alexander or World Trade Center. Maybe I've had my head in the sand but I didn't realize that Oliver made those. (stupid me)

    Anyway I'm glad I am not the only one who would like to see a movie made about this. I think it would be great and I would be there opening night. Also it would have been great to see Bobby win the Presidency (I have no doubt he would've) and go on to expose his brother's real killers. Also I thought it was a good idea for him to run considering Johnson no longer wanted to be president. But I digress................

    Also have you seen Oliver Stone's Nixon? I watched it and I loved it. It seems that Tricky Dick wasn't just guilty of the Watergate coverup.


    Thanks so much. I am glad to be back. :) :) :) :)
  • PurpleHazePurpleHaze
    Posts: 717
    author said:


    I have never seen Alexander or World Trade Center. Maybe I've had my head in the sand but I didn't realize that Oliver made those. (stupid me)

    Anyway I'm glad I am not the only one who would like to see a movie made about this. I think it would be great and I would be there opening night. Also it would have been great to see Bobby win the Presidency (I have no doubt he would've) and go on to expose his brother's real killers. Also I thought it was a good idea for him to run considering Johnson no longer wanted to be president. But I digress................

    Also have you seen Oliver Stone's Nixon? I watched it and I loved it. It seems that Tricky Dick wasn't just guilty of the Watergate coverup.

    Thanks so much. I am glad to be back. :) :) :) :)



    I would recommend Alexander (Stone's retelling of the life of Alexander the Great) but WTC was basically only about firemen trapped under the rubble. Not that there's anything wrong with that, but Stone avoided any hint of 9-11 conspiracy.

    I liked Nixon, although Hardball's Chris Matthews claims that Whitehouse tapes now "debunk" the notion that Tricky Dick was referring to the JFK assassination when he talked about "the Bay of Pigs thing." I dunno about that.

    New tapes debunk Oliver Stone's "Nixon'
    http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?file=/examiner/archive/1998/01/01/EDITORIAL4771.dtl

    Have you heard that Stone is currently making a movie about GW Bush?  ;D

    Oliver Stone to trace George W. Bush's path from 'alcoholic bum' to president in controversial new biopic
    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/tvshowbiz/article-554250/Oliver-Stone-trace-George-W-Bushs-path-alcoholic-bum-president-controversial-new-biopic.html

    image
  • I have heard about the Bush movie. I can't wait to see it. ;D ;D ;D ;D

    I read that article and it sounds like someone trying to debunk Stone's work. Remember how the movie JFK was attacked? I think this is similar to that. Plus I also wouldn't put much stock in Chris Matthews either and the only way I would believe that is if I heard those tapes myself. The only reporter out there telling things like it is is Keith Olbermann.

    Anyway I think it's weird that E. Howard Hunt and Frank Sturgis's names keep popping up in the Bay of Pigs, JFK Assassination, AND Watergate. It makes me wonder what they were really stealing and why was Nixon supposedly paying Hunt?



  • MinMMinM
    Posts: 439
    author said:


    I have heard about the Bush movie. I can't wait to see it. ;D ;D ;D ;D

    I read that article and it sounds like someone trying to debunk Stone's work. Remember how the movie JFK was attacked? I think this is similar to that. Plus I also wouldn't put much stock in Chris Matthews either and the only way I would believe that is if I heard those tapes myself. The only reporter out there telling things like it is is Keith Olbermann.

    Anyway I think it's weird that E. Howard Hunt and Frank Sturgis's names keep popping up in the Bay of Pigs, JFK Assassination, AND Watergate. It makes me wonder what they were really stealing and why was Nixon supposedly paying Hunt?


    Good catch, JFKRFK4Ever.

    I would go to Bill O'Reilly about the JFK case before I listened to Chris Matthews. It seems to be a very selective reading of the Nixon Tapes. Here's more on that 'Whole Bay of Pigs' thing:

    http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=385x148855

  • Thanks for the link MinM. :) :) :)

    To get back on topic: Do you think that Oliver Stone should make a movie about Robert Kennedy's murder the way he did with JFK?
  • MinMMinM
    Posts: 439
    author said:


    Thanks for the link MinM. :) :) :)

    To get back on topic: Do you think that Oliver Stone should make a movie about Robert Kennedy's murder the way he did with JFK?


    Absolutely .. unfortunately the M$M has done such a thorough hit job on Oliver .. painting him with the 'conspiracy nut' brush .. it would be difficult  for him at this point to launch such a project. Stone admits as much starting at the 3-minute mark here:



    Ideally a Steven Spielberg or Tom Hanks .. somebody with more cache .. would come over from the 'dark side' and allow a project like this to get a fair shake from the studios and media. Given how unlikely that would be -- Yes, Oliver Stone should go out in a blaze of glory -- and make 'RFK the Movie':


  • MinMMinM
    Posts: 439
    Until that movie is made -- don't hold your breath -- recommend 'The Parallax View':


    image


    Which basically takes the opening scene from the infamous pantry in the Ambassador Hotel and plays that scenario out on the Seattle Space Needle:
    image image
    and the final scene is taken from Dealey Plaza to a Convention Hall.
    image
    BTW the closest thing I've seen to portraying Chappaquiddick on film is the movie Blow Out (1981).
    image

    The Parallax View | Warren Beatty | Alan J. Pakula | Paula Prentiss | Movie Trailer | Review
    http://www.reelz.com/trailer-clips/37241/the-parallax-view-trailer
    http://www.rigorousintuition.ca/board2/viewtopic.php?p=351636#p351636
  • PurpleHazePurpleHaze
    Posts: 717
    This decision by Robert Kennedy to take on Lyndon B. Johnson caused Jackie Kennedy great concern. A few days after Kennedy announced his candidacy, Jackie said to Arthur Schlesinger at a dinner party in New York: “Do you know what I think will happen to Bobby?” When Schlesinger replied that he didn’t, she said: “The same thing that happened to Jack.”  http://www.spartacus.schoolnet.co.uk/USAkennedyR.htm

    author said:


    Yes, Oliver Stone should go out in a blaze of glory -- and make 'RFK the Movie'



    He may well go out in a "blaze of glory" after making W!  :o

    author said:


    I thought it was a good idea for him to run considering Johnson no longer wanted to be president.



    Now, I'm digressing too, but in the interest of historical accuracy, RFK announced his candidacy before Johnson shocked us all with his "I shall not seek, and I will not accept, the nomination of my party for another term as your president..." There was definitely some resentment toward Kennedy amongst those of us who'd appreciated Gene McCarthy's brave, uphill battle against Johnson. RFK was seen as an opportunist who'd only jumped into the fray after McCarthy had seriously wounded LBJ, against tremendous odds. I remember being very pleased when McCarthy beat Kennedy in Oregon. Which is not to say that I wasn't stunned almost beyond belief (and saddened) when Bobby was shot, just two months after MLK. Several of my teachers and many of my classmates were rooting for Kennedy, and the atmosphere at school was very somber that day. Had he lived, I'm pretty sure that Kennedy would've beaten Nixon, and wouldn't that have been ironic? (Of course, that's why he was killed, too) It just bothers me a little, sometimes, that Eugene McCarthy's role in unseating LBJ is often overlooked. I still have a "McCarthy for President" bumper sticker inside my high school yearbook. Jesus, I'm getting old...  :-[
    ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    image

    Eugene McCarthy, a circumspect liberal, challenged Johnson in the primaries on an anti-war platform. His campaign drew in many students, and going ‘clean for Gene’ (cutting hair and shaving beards when canvassing for McCarthy) became a media-touted phenomenon.

    Against all predictions, on 12 March McCarthy came a close second to Johnson in New Hampshire. Four days later, Robert Kennedy announced his candidacy, making a clear bid for the anti-war vote. On 31 March, Johnson bowed out of the race. 
    http://www.redpepper.org.uk/1968-The-Mysterious-Chemistry-of

    In the national election year of 1968 the quagmire of the Vietnam War made the vulnerability of the Democratic Party apparent. Eugene McCarthy, the enigmatic senator from Minnesota, led the dissent against President Johnson's leadership of the Vietnam War. In a moral crusade with enthusiastic backing on college campuses, the professorial McCarthy scored an unexpected victory in the New Hampshire primary that March by running even with the President, who subsequently dropped out of the race.  http://www.bilkent.edu.tr/~jast/Number1/Goodheart.html

    "And we’re certain that Lyndon Johnson, in order to avoid embarrassment of a sitting President losing to a poet senator, withdrew himself from the nomination. And that all became clear instantly to every one of us, that that was a critical victory in what we saw as kind of a long-term struggle, and there’s no question that was a huge high point. We basically floated back to Saint Louis, and it shows that college kids could in fact make a difference."  http://amlives.artsci.wustl.edu/transcripts/full/895.pdf

    Kennedy had supported the war in Vietnam and continued to support it in private, but this was skilfully suppressed as he competed against the maverick Eugene McCarthy, whose surprise win in the New Hampshire primary on an anti-war ticket had forced President Lyndon Johnson to abandon the idea of another term.  http://thinkforyourselfatalltimes.blogspot.com/2008/07/after-bobby-kennedy.html

    image

    http://www.eugenemccarthy.org/content/

    McCarthy served two terms in the U.S. Senate, and before that five terms in the House of Representatives. His political zenith came in 1968. His opposition to the Vietnam War turned into a crusade to capture the Democratic presidential nomination. McCarthy didn't win. But his candidacy, and the 1968 campaign, left lasting imprints on American politics.
    http://news.minnesota.publicradio.org/features/2005/06/15_olsond_genemccarthy/

  • PurpleHazePurpleHaze
    Posts: 717
    author said:


    BTW the closest thing I've seen to portraying Chappaquiddick on film is the movie Blow Out (1981).
    image



    Does anyone here think Oliver Stone should make a movie about Chappaquiddick?

    I believe 100% that JFK and RFK were the victims of conspiracies, but I have a very hard time accepting the same about Teddy and Chappaquiddick. This article at ratical.org is so farfetched, and full of contradictions and holes, that you could drive an Oldsmobile through it. http://www.ratical.org/ratville/JFK/ToA/ToAchp7.html

    I think Ted was drunk, screwed up, covered up, and Mary Jo Kopechne paid the price. And, I think he got off with a slap on the wrist because he's rich and influential. Heresy, I know.  :-\  I do agree that Parallax View and Blow Out are great flicks. Bulworth and Wag the Dog made pretty good points, too.

    "I regard as indefensible the fact that I did not report the accident to the police immediately."
    image
  • PurpleHazePurpleHaze
    Posts: 717
    author said:


    I believe 100% that JFK and RFK were the victims of conspiracies, but I have a very hard time accepting the same about Teddy and Chappaquiddick.



    Which doesn't mean I'm right, I'm just saying I have a hard time believing it. Which... one might think, would give JFK/RFK4Ever or MinM a perfect opportunity to jump in and make the case that yes, indeed, Teddy was bushwhacked and framed at Chappaquiddick. In the end, neither I nor anyone else can disprove it. In fairness to JFK/RFK4Ever, she didn't bring this up in this thread - her thread - and now I feel bad for taking it off topic or "muddying it up." But, when I see things that I think are inaccurate or questionable, the little demon that lives in my tortured brain compels me to respond. I'm not trying to be an asshole... it just comes naturally. ;) Often I feel like this board should be named "Shrine to the holy, sacred, Kennedy clan, saviors of all mankind, who can do no wrong and whose shit smells like roses picked from God's own garden." Is that part of the problem here? I digress... I was, in fact, very happy to see both of you, JFK/RFK4Ever and MinM, posting again. I've been meaning to respond to a couple of DoctorNo's recent posts, but haven't gotten around to it yet. BlackOp is one of my favorite online programs, and I was hoping that this board would take off like gangbusters... Where ARE you people?

    Oh, shit, I gotta run, the men in the clean white coats are coming...  :o

    Does anyone here think Oliver Stone should make a movie about RFK? ... ANYONE?

    t mack durham?
    pat1?
    BillAmbrosino?
    art46?
    Stu Rodgers?
    codygirly?
    tycoon52?
    tmr3513?
    Old Patriot?
    Pit_bull57?
    Maple38?
    Ssteve60?
    twnorman?
    herman54?
    pamelajfk?
    barbh?
    dr.apricot?
    ptenonio?
    GlassRace?
    Greg Burnham?
    Thatsmystory?
    caveman?

    et al....

    Evidence that Ted Kennedy was Framed by CIA - Chappaquiddick
    http://www.blackopforum.info/index.php/topic,122.0.html
  • Thanks for the historical correction PurpleHaze. :) :)

    I am of the belief that it isn't far fetched to think that Ted Kennedy may have been framed for Chappaquiddick. Now some of the theories out there seem a little weird I admit but who's to say he wasn't set up? I think after Bobby was killed it became apparent that they would never allow another Kennedy to become President. Now I don't know how they could pull something like that off but I refuse to discount the possibility.

    Also I have seen from many sources on the net that John Dean said something in a conversation to Nixon "If Teddy knew the bear trap he was walking into at Chappaquiddick." OK now why would he say something like that if it was all teddy's fault? It makes no sense to me. Here are some sources on John Dean's comment. (My thread on Chappaquiddick is referenced on yahoo search and on a forum. I just thought it was cool. lol)
    http://search.yahoo.com/search;_ylt=Ah4CHdsVh8tlkNTglYfYRgFG2vAI?p=If+Teddy+knew+the+bear+trap+he+was+walking+into+at+Chappaquiddick&fr=my-myy&toggle=1&cop=&ei=UTF-8

    Here is the topic on the forum that it's referenced on.
    http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=125x205847

  • PurpleHazePurpleHaze
    Posts: 717
    author said:


    Thanks for the historical correction PurpleHaze. :) :)

    I am of the belief that it isn't far fetched to think that Ted Kennedy may have been framed for Chappaquiddick. Now some of the theories out there seem a little weird I admit but who's to say he wasn't set up? I think after Bobby was killed it became apparent that they would never allow another Kennedy to become President. Now I don't know how they could pull something like that off but I refuse to discount the possibility.

    Also I have seen from many sources on the net that John Dean said something in a conversation to Nixon "If Teddy knew the bear trap he was walking into at Chappaquiddick." OK now why would he say something like that if it was all teddy's fault? It makes no sense to me. Here are some sources on John Dean's comment. (My thread on Chappaquiddick is referenced on yahoo search and on a forum. I just thought it was cool. lol)
    http://search.yahoo.com/search;_ylt=Ah4CHdsVh8tlkNTglYfYRgFG2vAI?p=If+Teddy+knew+the+bear+trap+he+was+walking+into+at+Chappaquiddick&fr=my-myy&toggle=1&cop=&ei=UTF-8

    Here is the topic on the forum that it's referenced on.
    http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=125x205847



    I'm just glad that you aren't PO'd at me, JFKRFK4Ever.  :-*  It's really all MinM's fault, though, as usual.  ;) I tried to find a context, online, for the Dean remark about Teddy and the beartrap, but couldn't. Dean could've just meant "had Teddy only known what he was doing to himself when he got drunk and left the party with a sweet young thing..." "Beartrap" is peculiar wording, though, I agree.

    I think after Bobby was killed it became apparent that they would never allow another Kennedy to become President. Now I don't know how they could pull something like that off but I refuse to discount the possibility.

    It's possible, but even if Chappaquiddick had never happened, and Ted had run in '72, I think Nixon would've beaten him. It might not have been the total landslide that el Dicko scored over McGovern, but "Umurika" was tired of thinking about the war by then, tired of protests and riots and assassinations... I think Nixon represented "stability" for a burned-out country. I voted for McGovern.  ;)
  • Oh no I'm not made at all. :-*

    Anyway I do think Ted would've beat Nixon. I mean he couldn't beat JFK, he knew he couldn't beat Bobby, and I think he knew he wouldn't be able to beat Ted. At least that's what I think.
  • author said:


    Oh no I'm not made at all. :-*

    Anyway I do think Ted would've beat Nixon. I mean he couldn't beat JFK, he knew he couldn't beat Bobby, and I think he knew he wouldn't be able to beat Ted. At least that's what I think.



    Ah c'mon, now, Christina. I'll bet you've been made a time or two!  :D (Urful, I know...)

    A strong case can be made that Nixon actually beat JFK in 1960, but I'm not going to make it. I think Robert would've won in '68, but I have serious doubts about Ted in '72, even without Chappaquiddick hanging over his head. I don't think Nixon was beatable, by any Democrat, in 1972. (MHO)

    Getting back to "Stone's RFK," would you envision it being similar to JFK and Bobby, with the actual RFK being shown in clips and no actor portraying him?

  • I would envision it being more similar to JFK because I would like it to focus on the details/evidence of his death like JFK did. There are so many unknown facts about this that I would love to see brought to light.

    Maybe you're right about Ted but you have to admit that Nixon had his work cut out for him when it came to running against a Kennedy. 
  • author said:


    I would envision it being more similar to JFK because I would like it to focus on the details/evidence of his death like JFK did. There are so many unknown facts about this that I would love to see brought to light.

    Maybe you're right about Ted but you have to admit that Nixon had his work cut out for him when it came to running against a Kennedy.



    I doubt that one in a hundred people in this country are familiar with the "oddities" connected to RFK's murder, (one in a thousand?) so yes, it'd be great to see O.S. revisit the RFK shooting enigma and educate the public, as he did with JFK.

    Getting back to "Stone's RFK," would you envision it being similar to JFK and Bobby, with the actual RFK being shown in clips and no actor portraying him?

    I was imagining the movie, and I think it could be done without anybody playing the part of RFK, as in Bobby, (just using clips) although the pantry scene might require actors playing Sirhan, Kennedy, and Cesar, in order to demonstrate the firing angles.

    I was fairly disappointed, as you were, with Bobby. It seemed like Estevez was just trying to remind people that he existed. Of course, with today's "dumbed down" populace, that counts for something.

    * I was scanning the board before I saw your post, looking for the Jesse Ventura thread, but I can't find it anywhere. He gave a hell of a speech the other day, and I was going to post the YouTube links. Sometimes I can look and look, and then the "missing item" pops up where I know I looked before... scary.  :o 
  • I think that would be a good idea about the pantry scene. There's a lot of information to absorb concerning this and I think it would help if people had a visual for it.
  • author said:


    I think that would be a good idea about the pantry scene. There's a lot of information to absorb concerning this and I think it would help if people had a visual for it.



    image

    Oops. Wrong assassination.

    If Stone made "RFK" and implicated Cesar, could Cesar turn around and sue him for slander?

    Would making "RFK" actually achieve anything? I think "JFK" is great, and I'm glad O.S. made it, but in truth, it hasn't changed anything, has it? Whoever got away with murder in Dealey Plaza have still gotten away with it, despite "JFK," haven't they? School kids are still having it drummed into their heads that "Oswald did it, all by himself," and the mainstream media go on dutifully towing the official line, of course. As the years pass, the 60's are becoming "ancient history." I remember JFK as a living president, and believe me, it feels like a lifetime ago. Twenty years from now, I don't think the assassination of the Kennedy brothers will hold any more meaning or relevance for the average American than the slaying of Abraham Lincoln. These murders will always be studied and discussed as footnotes to history, but remain eternal mysteries.

    Am I wrong? I would like to be wrong.

    next morning PS: Happy to see you and That'smystory posting again.
  • author said:


    author said:


    I think that would be a good idea about the pantry scene. There's a lot of information to absorb concerning this and I think it would help if people had a visual for it.



    image

    Oops. Wrong assassination.

    If Stone made "RFK" and implicated Cesar, could Cesar turn around and sue him for slander?

    Would making "RFK" actually achieve anything? I think "JFK" is great, and I'm glad O.S. made it, but in truth, it hasn't changed anything, has it? Whoever got away with murder in Dealey Plaza have still gotten away with it, despite "JFK," haven't they? School kids are still having it drummed into their heads that "Oswald did it, all by himself," and the mainstream media go on dutifully towing the official line, of course. As the years pass, the 60's are becoming "ancient history." I remember JFK as a living president, and believe me, it feels like a lifetime ago. Twenty years from now, I don't think the assassination of the Kennedy brothers will hold any more meaning or relevance for the average American than the slaying of Abraham Lincoln. These murders will always be studied and discussed as footnotes to history, but remain eternal mysteries.

    Am I wrong? I would like to be wrong.



    Correct me if I'm wrong but didn't documents get released due to JFK? It seems like I remember that either from the end of the movie or the documentary. I know it's not much but at least it's something.  :)

  • author said:



    Correct me if I'm wrong but didn't documents get released due to JFK? It seems like I remember that either from the end of the movie or the documentary. I know it's not much but at least it's something.  :)



    I guess we're here at the same time. Hi, how are ya?  ;) You're probably right about the documents, I don't know, or have forgotten. I'm just getting older, (naturally - duh) more cynical and more depressed as time passes. I'm doubting the bastards will ever have to answer for 9-11, let alone the crimes of the 60's. They're collapsing the economy now, in effect establishing an in-our-face dictatorship wherein the crooks at the top can engage in outrageous financial scams and walk away with billions in ill-gotten gains, while we lowly peons are literally forced to absorb their debts. Like many others, I've seen this coming for years, but feel like I (we) can't do anything about it.  :-\
    -------------------------------------------------------------

    Dear American:

    I need to ask you to support an urgent secret business relationship with a transfer of funds of great magnitude.

    I am Ministry of the Treasury of the Republic of America. My country has had crisis that has caused the need for large transfer of funds of 800 billion dollars US. If you would assist me in this transfer, it would be most profitable to you.
     
    I am working with Mr. Phil Gram, lobbyist for UBS, who will be my replacement as Ministry of the Treasury in January. As a Senator, you may know him as the leader of the American banking deregulation movement in the 1990s. This transaction is 100% safe.

    This is a matter of great urgency. We need a blank check. We need the funds as quickly as possible. We cannot directly transfer these funds in the names of our close friends because we are constantly under surveillance. My family lawyer advised me that I should look for a reliable and trustworthy person who will act as a next of kin so the funds can be transferred.
     
    Please reply with all of your bank account, IRA and college fund account numbers and those of your children and grandchildren to wallstreetbailout@treasury.gov so that we may transfer your commission for this transaction. After I receive that information, I will respond with detailed information about safeguards that will be used to protect the funds.
     
    Yours Faithfully
    Minister of Treasury Paulson

    ************************
  • TV News Report:
    Multiple Shooters In Robert Kennedy Assassination...
    http://www.evtv1.com/player.aspx?itemnum=11285

    (Four months old. The MSM will just let this fade away, of course.)
  • I'm straying off the path here, (sorry JFKRFK4Ever) but since I touched on Wall Street's $700 billion scam a couple of posts up, this seemed as good a place as any to mention Patrick (son of Ted) Kennedy's vote in FAVOR of it. I'm happy that the vultures were driven off today, although it's a sure bet that just like The Terminator, "they'll be back."
    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    "I don't see one penny of that $700 billion ending up helping the broader economy. I see it being used to prop up share prices so the insiders can salvage as much as possible when dumping their shares".

    The bill was just Paulson's way of carving a silver canoe for he and his brandy-drooling investor buddies so they can paddle away to some offshore haven while the rest of us drown in a bottomless ocean of debthttp://www.counterpunch.org/whitney09292008.html

    Patrick Kennedy, Rhode Island: "YES"
    http://clerk.house.gov/evs/2008/roll674.xml

    Kennedy: "I commend the Democratic Leadership, including Chris Dodd, Barney Frank, Nancy Pelosi, and Harry Reid for extracting enormous concessions from the Administration during their negotiations on this critical piece of legislation.”

    It is true, there are no guarantees with this plan, but we owe it to our constituents to act on their behalf..." and blah, blah, blah...
    http://www.patrickkennedy.house.gov/PRArticle.aspx?NewsID=1453

    Kennedy voted YES on Bankruptcy Overhaul (Mar 2001)
    --------------------------------------------------------------

    Laugh of the day...

    McCain takes credit for bill before it loses
    Sen. John McCain (R-Ariz.) and his top aides took credit for building a winning bailout coalition – hours before the vote failed and stocks tanked.
    http://dyn.politico.com/printstory.cfm?uuid=AF9F10EC-18FE-70B2-A82949C5A24271A8

    Update: Fri Oct 03, 2008
    image

    House Passes $700B Financial "Bailout" Bill


    RIP: Constitutional Rights in the USA -- You are all now debt slaves.
    http://worldpressnetwork.net/forum/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=533
  • OCTOBER 5, 2008
    Say WHAT? Matt Lauer to RFK Jr: “How’s Your Dad?”
    http://rfkjrforpresident.com/2008/10/05/say-what-matt-lauer-to-rfk-jr-hows-your-dad/



    Media Watchr
    October 6, 2008 at 11:10 am
    I wish Kennedy would have said something like: “he’s still dead, Matt…and yours?”
  • Has Stone lost it? Mass murderer Smirk is "endearing in a strange, goofy, awkward way," and his father, who invaded Iraq and Panama, (to get rid of his partner in crime, Noriega) and may have had a hand in killing JFK, was "diplomatic."

    CNN - Oliver Stone on new Bush movie
    Monday, October 6, 2008

    George W. Bush's ascent to the presidency was "bigger than fiction," director Oliver Stone told "Larry King Live" Monday night, describing his soon-to-be released biopic, "W."

    Stone, whose film opens October 17 -- less than three weeks before the November 4 presidential election -- said he was fascinated by Bush, "a bum at the age of 40 years old."

    "He turned his whole life around and through evangelism and through his faith and his family and he became president," Stone said.

    [by way of two stolen elections, but what the hell... ph]

    "It's a great fantasy and it happened. It's bigger than fiction," said Stone.

    Stone said while he supports Sen. Barack Obama, the Democratic nominee in the presidential race, his personal politics didn't influence the film.

    "I -- I couldn't make a movie with hate or malice. There is none in this movie. I see the guy as more like John Wayne, which is to say I don't like his politics but he's endearing in a strange, goofy, awkward way, and he did capture the imagination of the country," he said.

    From "JFK" to "Natural Born Killers," Stone's films have made him a lightning rod for controversy -- and "W" is unlikely to change that. In the film, he draws a contrast between President Bush and his father, former President George H.W. Bush, whom Stone says was a "far more diplomatic" commander in chief.

    "We went to war in Iraq and he did not go all the way," referring to the elder Bush. "So that becomes a big issue in the movie. He didn't get rid of Saddam then and the son has to be -- feels that he has to act stronger than the father because of emotional reasons and there's a lot of father-son subcurrent in the movie. He is challenged by his father and he wants to outdo him, he wants to be stronger than him."

    http://www.cnn.com/2008/SHOWBIZ/Movies/10/06/oliver.stone.bush.movie/index.html?iref=mpstoryview
  • Another RFK film that will not address conspiracy.

    Tuesday, February 23rd, 2010
    Matt Damon To Star in Robert F Kennedy Biopic His Life
    by Peter Sciretta  http://www.slashfilm.com/2010/02/23/matt-damon-to-star-in-robert-f-kennedy-biopic-his-life/

    image

    Nikki Finke is reporting that Matt Damon is going to star in a biopic of Robert F Kennedy for New Regency. Directed by Gary Ross, and written by Dirty Pretty Things and Eastern Promises scribe Steven Knight. The film will be adapted from the Evan Thomas-penned biography His Life, published in 2000.

    Ross burst into Hollywood as the screenwriter and co-producer of Big. He also wrote Mr. Baseball, Dave and Lassie before making his feature directorial debut with Pleasentville. He has since wrote and directed Seabiscuit and the animated film The Tale of Despereaux.

    Here is the official description from Thomas’ book:
    He was “Good Bobby,” who, as his brother Ted eulogized him, “saw wrong and tried to right it . . . saw suffering and tried to heal it.” And “Bad Bobby,” the ruthless and manipulative bully of countless conspiracy theories. Thomas’s unvarnished but sympathetic and fair-minded portrayal is packed with new details about Kennedy’s early life and his behind-the-scenes machinations, including new revelations about the 1960 and 1968 presidential campaigns, the Cuban Missile Crisis, and his long struggles with J. Edgar Hoover and Lyndon Johnson.

    The Library Journal wrote the following about the book:
    Thomas’s narrative, skillfully woven from numerous interviews, vividly reveals a very human Kennedy struggling to come to terms with his brother’s assassination, his role in wiretapping Martin Luther King Jr., and his fatal decision to take on Eugene McCarthy and Hubert Humphrey in the 1968 Democratic primary. Thomas’s chilling account of the Cuban Missile Crisis shows Kennedy at his best, while his portrayal of his feuds with FBI director J. Edgar Hoover and Cuban president Fidel Castro reveal him at his worst. Thomas convincingly debunks a number of the myths that envelop Kennedy.

    The book is available in paperback from Amazon for around $11-12. For those of you who don’t know how RFK looked, I’ve also included video of RFK’s famous Indianapolis speech, in which he revealed to a mostly black crowd the news that Martin Luther King had been assassinated.
  • robert1robert1
    Posts: 116

    FYI:  I didn't know until recently that Oliver Stone also wrote the screenplay for the movie SCARFACE.  The 1980/81 movie included the main character coming from Cuba during the time Castro opened up a port to allow Cubans to take private (I believe) boats to Florida in 1980.  The movie had stock footage of Castro and the screen read that of the 125,000 Cubans who arrived in Florida, 25,000 had criminal records.  Others were known to have been released from other institutions including mental institutions. 
  • MinMMinM
    Posts: 439

    This decision by Robert Kennedy to take on Lyndon B. Johnson caused Jackie Kennedy great concern. A few days after Kennedy announced his candidacy, Jackie said to Arthur Schlesinger at a dinner party in New York: “Do you know what I think will happen to Bobby?” When Schlesinger replied that he didn’t, she said: “The same thing that happened to Jack.”  http://www.spartacus.schoolnet.co.uk/USAkennedyR.htm

    Yes, Oliver Stone should go out in a blaze of glory -- and make 'RFK the Movie

    He may well go out in a "blaze of glory" after making W!  :o


    Now, I'm digressing too, but in the interest of historical accuracy, RFK announced his candidacy before Johnson shocked us all with his "I shall not seek, and I will not accept, the nomination of my party for another term as your president..." There was definitely some resentment toward Kennedy amongst those of us who'd appreciated Gene McCarthy's brave, uphill battle against Johnson. RFK was seen as an opportunist who'd only jumped into the fray after McCarthy had seriously wounded LBJ, against tremendous odds. I remember being very pleased when McCarthy beat Kennedy in Oregon. Which is not to say that I wasn't stunned almost beyond belief (and saddened) when Bobby was shot, just two months after MLK. Several of my teachers and many of my classmates were rooting for Kennedy, and the atmosphere at school was very somber that day. Had he lived, I'm pretty sure that Kennedy would've beaten Nixon, and wouldn't that have been ironic? (Of course, that's why he was killed, too) It just bothers me a little, sometimes, that Eugene McCarthy's role in unseating LBJ is often overlooked. I still have a "McCarthy for President" bumper sticker inside my high school yearbook. Jesus, I'm getting old...  :-[
    ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    http://www.jofreeman.com/photos/McCarthy/McCarthy.jpg

    Eugene McCarthy, a circumspect liberal, challenged Johnson in the primaries on an anti-war platform. His campaign drew in many students, and going ‘clean for Gene’ (cutting hair and shaving beards when canvassing for McCarthy) became a media-touted phenomenon.

    Against all predictions, on 12 March McCarthy came a close second to Johnson in New Hampshire. Four days later, Robert Kennedy announced his candidacy, making a clear bid for the anti-war vote. On 31 March, Johnson bowed out of the race. 
    http://www.redpepper.org.uk/1968-The-Mysterious-Chemistry-of

    In the national election year of 1968 the quagmire of the Vietnam War made the vulnerability of the Democratic Party apparent. Eugene McCarthy, the enigmatic senator from Minnesota, led the dissent against President Johnson's leadership of the Vietnam War. In a moral crusade with enthusiastic backing on college campuses, the professorial McCarthy scored an unexpected victory in the New Hampshire primary that March by running even with the President, who subsequently dropped out of the race.  http://www.bilkent.edu.tr/~jast/Number1/Goodheart.html

    "And we’re certain that Lyndon Johnson, in order to avoid embarrassment of a sitting President losing to a poet senator, withdrew himself from the nomination. And that all became clear instantly to every one of us, that that was a critical victory in what we saw as kind of a long-term struggle, and there’s no question that was a huge high point. We basically floated back to Saint Louis, and it shows that college kids could in fact make a difference."  http://amlives.artsci.wustl.edu/transcripts/full/895.pdf

    Kennedy had supported the war in Vietnam and continued to support it in private, but this was skilfully suppressed as he competed against the maverick Eugene McCarthy, whose surprise win in the New Hampshire primary on an anti-war ticket had forced President Lyndon Johnson to abandon the idea of another term.  http://thinkforyourselfatalltimes.blogspot.com/2008/07/after-bobby-kennedy.html

    http://www.eugenemccarthy.org/content/Portals/0/mccarthy_windsofchange.jpg

    http://www.eugenemccarthy.org/content/

    McCarthy served two terms in the U.S. Senate, and before that five terms in the House of Representatives. His political zenith came in 1968. His opposition to the Vietnam War turned into a crusade to capture the Democratic presidential nomination. McCarthy didn't win. But his candidacy, and the 1968 campaign, left lasting imprints on American politics.
    http://news.minnesota.publicradio.org/features/2005/06/15_olsond_genemccarthy/



    image

    CIA backed Eugene McCarthy in '68 v. RFK
    Quote:
    “A Tale of Two Doves,” JFK Assassination Forum, No.7, (April 1975), p.2:

    “…when
    a dove of more conservative cast, Gene McCarthy, decided to oppose
    Johnson for the nomination, the CIA promptly infiltrated his campaign.

    Names
    to conjure with: Allard Lowenstein, Curtis Gans and Sam Brown.
    Ostensibly these men were concerned with ‘containing’ the student
    anti-war movement. The motto of McCarthy’s student supporters was ‘Keep
    clean for Gene’ – none of your Hoffmans or Rubins, please.

    In
    early 1968, when McCarthy’s campaign seemed dangerously short of funds,
    help was forthcoming from West Coast industrialist Sam Kimball, chairman
    of Aerojet-General Corp. whose representative in Washington was Admiral
    Raborn, a former CIA chief.

    When Robert Kennedy…entered the
    nomination stakes, two more ‘former’ CIA men, Thomas Finney and Thomas
    McCoy joined McCarthy’s campaign. (For fuller information, see Private
    Eye 169.)”


    According to Time (“The Nonconsensus,” Friday, Jul. 05, 1968 – see this link: http://www.time.com/time/magazine/artic ... 95,00.html ),Thomas Finney was “the Senator's organization chief.”

    In 1980, William Blum notes, good old Gene, the eternal splitter of the anti-Republican vote, backed Reagan...

    http://www.rigorousintuition.ca/board2/viewtopic.php?p=409908#p409908
  • MinMMinM
    Posts: 439
    RFK: The Movie



    image
    As Lisa Pease points out in the interview and article linked below -- the RFK case is much less convoluted than the JFK case. So if you show Thane Eugene Cesar
    firing from the only spot that Thomas Noguchi determined the fatal shot
    came from, and RFK with Cesar's tie next to him after a futile attempt
    to grab his killer, Game Over.
    image
    Quote:
    Show #554
    Original airdate: Nov 27, 2011
    Guest: Jim DiEugenio, Lisa Pease, Ira David Wood III
    Topics: J. Edgar, RFK, The JFK Assassination Chronology


    # Play Part Two - Lisa Pease (40:10) Real Media or MP3 download

    # Lisa discusses her RFK case article in Salon magazine (Nov 21, 2011)
    # It's impossible to paint Sirhan as the killer, Robert Kennedy was shot from behind from one to six inches away
    # Researchers spend years, most reporters don't have the time to research the truth, without a guide
    # Start occupying the public mind-space around conspiracy theory, historical investigation, legitimate theories
    # The assassination of Dag Hammarskjold, the UN Secretary-General, the plot to overthrow Patrice Lumumba in the Congo
    # Kennedy was going to stand behind Lumumba, the CIA rushed to take him out, during Kennedy's transition period
    # Hammarskjold's plane 'crashed', evidence that it was shot down, hitman Roland "Bud" Culligan, the Church Committee
    # We should be looking into and talking about taking people out to change policy. make it harder for them to happen
    # Recently, this Iranian plot to kill the Saudi ambassador on U.S. territory, a lot of journalists said 'smells like a setup'
    # The Occupy Movement, here in Los Angeles, unusually festive, we are the 99 percent, the LA police have been fantastic
    # Max Holland, JFK: The Lost Bullet, these programs don't have to be good, don't have to be accurate
    # If I was Allen Dulles, I would constantly fill the media with theses stories, repeat it enough times
    # Dealey Plaza, Nov 22, 2013, the Sixth Floor Museum is now taking over that space
    # In this information war We need a lot more soldiers, send to your friends the links to the good articles
    # Pick up Jim Douglass's book JFK & the Unspeakable (2008), best, latest, most condensed evidence in that case
    # Oswald did not fire a rifle that day, he had no nitrates on his cheek, CIA involvement, using Oswald
    # Laying a cover story in advance of the assassination, to trigger the cover-up among other agencies
    # Author Hank Albarelli, writing a book about George Hunter White, a CIA operative, Oswald in Mexico

    http://www.blackopradio.com/pod/black554b.mp3
  • MinMMinM
    Posts: 439

    OCTOBER 5, 2008
    Say WHAT? Matt Lauer to RFK Jr: “How’s Your Dad?”
    http://rfkjrforpresident.com/2008/10/05/say-what-matt-lauer-to-rfk-jr-hows-your-dad/



    Media Watchr
    October 6, 2008 at 11:10 am
    I wish Kennedy would have said something like: “he’s still dead, Matt…and yours?”



    Well Matt .. about 40 (now almost 50) years ago he got assassinated. It was in all the papers.